Oldest original proper computer (stored program etc)

[Charlie Carothers]

On 10/18/2010 6:58 AM, Roger Holmes wrote:
>> From: Christian Corti<cc at informatik.uni-stuttgart.de>
>>
>> On Sat, 16 Oct 2010, Roger Holmes wrote:
>>> don't believe its true, I was told my machine is currently the oldest
>>> original working computer. Not counting replicas or machines which don't
>>> have stored programs. My machine was installed in 1962 (and designed in
>>> the late 1950s).
>>
>> Then you've been told wrong.
>> Several examples:
>> - Our LGP-30 ser.no. 4, built 1958, still working with peripherals. Just
>>    yesterday I've had a group of visitors. It's been designed around 1954.
>> - The IBM 650 of the IBM Museum in Sindelfingen (working)
>> - The Zuse Z22 ser.no. 13 in Karlsruhe, also built around 1958 (apparently
>>    still working, although the ZKM is not the right place for it IMHO)
>> All are original first generation machines, and all of them are in
>> southern Germany.
>>
>>> restored was first installed in 1964. Are there other? I'm not counting
>>> the Zuse in Germany as its not a stored program machine, and anyway I'm
>>> not sure if it is a replica or the original. It is surprising if it
>>> survived the extensive bombing by the USAF and RAF during WW2 unless it
>>> was stored in a bunker/cave/mine.
>>
>> What Zuse are you talking about? The Z3 has been destroyed, yes, and
>> rebuilt by Zuse in 1962.
>
> Thank you, this is just the information I wanted.
>
> Is the Z3 stored program? Turing complete?
>
> If it is, then it would be useful to know when the rebuilt version became operational, though I'm not actually sure the actual month my machine went live either.
>
> Assuming for now that Z3 is not stored program, than my list so far is:
>
> 1958, LGP-30
> 1958, Zuse Z22
> Somewhere between 1954 and 1962, IBM 650
> 1962 ICT 1301 serial no 6 (SO FAR the earliest surviving machine with random access program and data storage. i.e. Core and called Immediate Access Store by ICT).
>
> Thanks again.
>
> I expect the chaps in the states will tell me of several more when I catch up with my e-mails.
>
>
>
According to this: 
http://www-03.ibm.com/ibm/history/exhibits/650/650_ch1.html the first 
650 was installed at a customer site in December, 1954.

I thought this was pretty interesting as well:
http://www-03.ibm.com/ibm/history/exhibits/mainframe/mainframe_FT1.html
It indicates the 701 was around in 1952.  I'm not sure if you want to 
limit your list to core memory or not.  It appears that the 701's 
internal memory consisted of a drum and a CRT.  In any case, I need to 
waste a lot more time exploring these pages. :-)
Later,
Charlie C.