David Griffith <dgriffi at cs.csubak.edu> wrote:
>> If ZORK were ever to run on any other machine that machine first and
>> foremost would have to have MDL. You know if SDS had that?
>> Second, ZORK used a lot of memory. Unless the OS supported virtual
>> memory, and a fairly large address space, that would also stop it.
>> Appearantly ZORK on the PDP-10 needed over 600K to run (if that is bytes
>> or 36-bit words I don't know, but I suspect bytes).
>
>
> FWIW, there exists in the Z-machine spec a setting which indicates on
what
> machine the interpreter is running. Depending on that setting, the game
> may behave differently. There was a setting for the PDP-10 (called
DECsystem 10).
Yep. Guess what ZEMU identifies itself as? :-)
The only game that I know of that cares are BEYOND ZORK, and it works
nice if you have a VT220 or newer, download the soft font I designed,
and then just play on...
If someone have a VT525, they could even test color...
Johnny
--
Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus
|| on a psychedelic trip
email: bqt at update.uu.se || Reading murder books
pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol
David Griffith <dgriffi at cs.csubak.edu> wrote:
> On Mon, 24 Apr 2006, Johnny Billquist wrote:
>
>>> People have been bouncing ZORK, DUNGEON and Infocom around a while now.
>
>
> IIRC, Zork was released in three parts parts because home computers
at the
> time could not handle a game the size of MDL Zork.
True in a way. The game was split up because it was too large. It was
also reimplemented because MDL didn't exist for home computers, and that
language in it self required too much resources and in general required
too much of the computer.
A big breakthrough was when they decided, and managed to pull off the
Z-machine.
You can all read about this at the http://www.csd.uwo.ca/Infocom/
website. Lots of articles and interviews with the original implementors.
>> And ZEMU *should* work on RT-11. I have a suspicion that maybe one or
>> two routines might be missing. If they are, it will takes us close to
>> zero time to fix it, if just someone with RT-11 steps up to the plate.
>> I don't have any RT-11 systems, nor much RT-11 knowledge myself. I can
>> write some code, but I definitely can't test it.
>
>
> If you can compile straight ANSI C on RT-11, you can use Dumb Frotz
there.
> The result won't have screen handling, but it'll run most any Z-machine
> program out there. Implementing screen-handling for an RT-11 version of
> Frotz shouldn't be very hard.
In your dreams. :-)
First of all, I suspect that dumb Frotz still would get into major
problems with the small address space of a PDP-11. Second, Frotz makes
some assumptions about file handling that just isn't true on all
non-Unix systems. And screen handling is a story of it's own.
But people are welcome to try. Heck, I can even offer an RSX machine if
someone wants to take a shot at it there, with an ANSI C compiler...
It would be interesting to watch, at least. People often just don't
understand how much Unix-specific stuff is going on in the code.
Johnny
--
Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus
|| on a psychedelic trip
email: bqt at update.uu.se || Reading murder books
pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol
I corrected ZIO and ZMEM, and they compile without errors,
as expected. Then I removed the "LIBRARY SYSTEM.MLB" line
in ZRT.MAC ... I get 65 errors, starting with MCALL undefines.
Is it possible that Megan can change this to support the RT11
version that comes with SIMH (v5.3) ?
(The changes required in ZIO and ZMEM are simple).
- Henk.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org
> [mailto:cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Johnny Billquist
> Sent: dinsdag 25 april 2006 19:31
> To: cctalk at classiccmp.org
> Subject: RE: Zemu
>
> "Gooijen, Henk" <henk.gooijen at oce.com> wrote:
>
> > OK, thanks Johnny.
> > I have a day off, but that's for working in the garden.
> > This evening (when my back is hurting) I will change the
> > hex values to octal.
>
> That should fix the first problem, and that should be easy...
>
> > If somebody could make the SYSTEM.MLB avalilable in a .zip
> file, would that > be sufficient to solve the second issue ?
>
> Might. I don't know what macros are used, and what they do.
> Remember, I don't really know RT-11.
> But, like I said, it might be that just commenting that line
> out, and see what macros fail will give you enough clues to
> what is missing that you can either safely remove that, or
> write those macros on your own.
>
> Johnny
>
> --
> Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus
> || on a psychedelic trip
> email: bqt at update.uu.se || Reading murder books
> pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol
>
>
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Thank you for your cooperation.
Where can I find information about it? There seems to be a dearth of
info online, despite DEC being really popular among collectors.
--
"The Direct3D Graphics Pipeline"-- code samples, sample chapter, FAQ:
<http://www.xmission.com/~legalize/book/>
Pilgrimage: Utah's annual demoparty
<http://pilgrimage.scene.org>
Hello all!
It's been a long time since I've stopped by to post... I monitor CCTalk
every now and then, but haven't posted in a long time.
I just thought I might send a quick message to say that my poor Mark-8 is
headed to the great ebay in the sky. I am too poor to keep him any longer
and I know somebody will end up enjoying it more than I'm able to at the
moment. 8799174918 on ebay if anyone might be interested.
I apologize hugely in advance if this is verboten; I didn't know who to ask
if it was OK! The old FAQ seemed to mention that it was OK, but the old FAQ
also said that it was not to be looked at. :)
Bryan Blackburn has helped me out a lot over the past few days - thank you!
:)
Best regards,
Andy
Looking for the "IBM VM/SP rel 5 Planning and System Generation Guide".
The VM/370 rel 6 equivalent is online at bitsavers, but I need the VM/SP rel
5 version.
Thanks!
Jay West
How do I convert a teledisk image to something useful to me without
having the hardware?
I have some images of decus DM-101 that are in teledisk format. I want
to get the contents onto my PDP-8/e.
I understand that teledisk saves a lot of meta-data about the disk
image... but I don't think I need that. All I want is the data.
decus DM-101 on paper tape would be fine with me... an EPIC tape would
be much better... and a simh disk image would be the greatest...
-chuck
Johhny Billquist wrote:
> First there was ZORK. That's it, just ZORK. No numbers,
> no nothing. This program was written in MDL and ran on
> PDP-10 systems only. MDL is a Lisp-like language implemented
> at MIT. You're probably out of luck if you ever want to
> play the original ZORK on anything but a PDP-10.
<Nitpick>
Actually, I saw (and used) the original ZORK running on an SDS (later XDS)
Sigma 7 computer (the actual ARPAnet machine name was MIT-DMS). And, if
I'm not mistaken, I believe it was originally developed on this machine
(though I could be off on this fact). I actually visited the famed 9th
floor of 545 Tech. Square at MIT way back in the early 80s and saw the beast.
(Still have my MDL programming manual around too...)
</Nitpick>
--Eric F. (proud owner of an SDS-940 console, Sigma 9 console (wired up to
show off all 100+ Blinkenlights!), and lots of other assorted SDS/XDS swag.)
I went scrounging this weekend and one of the things that I found was a
Cyberentics ASP. It's a chrome and black rack mount chassis with dual 2GHz
AMD Athlon MP processors, 256 Mb of DDR memory, a DriveOnModule that plugs
into the IDE port and emulates a 32Mb disk drive (has linux installed), TWO
Symbios LVD/SE SCSI cards and two large IBM Ultrim LTO tape drives. No
other drives installed (or even a place to mount them) except the two tape
drives and the Drive On Module. NO video card installed but it has two LCD
displays on the front panel.
What have I got here?
Joe
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: cctech-request at classiccmp.org
> To: cctech at classiccmp.org
> Subject: cctech Digest, Vol 32, Issue 48
> Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2006 06:17:52 -0500 (CDT)
...
> Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2006 23:42:16 -0400
> From: Patrick Finnegan <pat at computer-refuge.org>
> Subject: Re: anyone have a terminal server?
> To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts"
> <cctalk at classiccmp.org>
> Message-ID: <200604242342.16528.pat at computer-refuge.org>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-6"
>
> On Sunday 23 April 2006 14:47, Richard wrote:
> > I see that DEC has had a line of terminal servers. They look like
> > they would do the job (my needs are more along the lines of
> > connectivity rather than fancy features like 3270 support).
> >
> > Reading around on the net indicates that Xylogics had a good line of
> > terminal servers, but that the similarly named Xyplex had buggy
> > product.
>
> I've never heard anything all that good from people that have used
> Xylogics Annex boxes.
>
> At work, we use a whole bunch of Xyplex Maxserver 1640s for console
> servers, and they Just Work.. They're a direct descendant of DECservers
> (from what I understand, DEC sold off the line to Xyplex).
>
> Pat
> --
Pat, your understanding is incorrect.
Xyplex was founded by 3 ex-DECies as a terminal server company before Digital
had established the LAN DECserver and LAT. One of the founders
was the author of the CTERM protocol and witnessed the debacle of the Mercury
terminal server. (but I digress)
Their initial designs used proprietary LAN media and protocols. Their later
products used more commodized technology of the times.
I don't know the 'rep of their product. But the company was very successful
for awhile but was later acquired by Raetheon and then traded around the
aerospace/computer industry before disappearing.
Xylogics had been in business for many years doing various computer related
things, including peripherals and disk drives, before acquiring the rights to
the "Annex" product line from a third party. The products were based on a
proprietary Unix kernel and spoke telnet, PPP, and LAT and other things. I was
instrumental in getting them to implement RADIUS. In 1996 they were
accquired by Bay Networks where they continued to produce terminal server
products (5399 blade system) until the merger with Nortel. I'm not sure
what happened to the IPR of the Annex, I believe it was sold to another
company.
The former DEC terminal server line was spun off to Cabletron, and the
remains live in Enterasys.
I attempted to assertain whom owns the rights to LAT last year (as a
reference in RFC 4005 Diameter NAS Application) and got a murky answer. The
last vendor selling code (Meridian) went out-of-business a few years back.
Dave Mitton.
