test-drb

test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org

101090 discussions

by david＠thecoolbears.org

For 2.11BSD on the PDP-11, in the stand alone utilities that are found on the installation tape, the storage devices are named: dn(x,y,z) where dn is the mnemonic for the driver, x is the controller number, y is the unit number and z is the partition on the unit. So the first partition on the first drive on the first MSCP controller is ra(0,0,0). It's fairly easy form the install tape to disklabel and mkfs a drive on a second controller. Once UNIX is running, things change. The devices in /dev are named ra0 for the first unit on the first controller, ra1 for the second unit on the first controller and etc. I don't see a way in the naming convention to identify other controllers. My question is, what is the device name in /dev for the first drive on the second controller?

10 years

Meaning of "architecture width" - Re: 68K Macs with MacOS 7.5 still in production use...

by iamcamiel＠gmail.com

Op 15 sep. 2016 11:57 p.m. schreef "Toby Thain" <toby at telegraphics.com.au>: > > On 2016-09-15 2:38 PM, Noel Chiappa wrote: >> >> > From: Chuck Guzis >> >> > Call it anything you want, but we know what Motorola called it. >> >> The _first implementation_ may have been 16-bit, but I am in no doubt >> whatsover (having written a lot of assembler code for the 68K family) >> that the _architecture_ was 32-bit: >> >> - 32-bit registers >> - many operations (arithmetical, logical, etc) defined for that length >> - 32-bit addresses > > > GPR width, being the visible programmer model, is the most common and convenient definition of "architecture" I've come across. But there's no reason we can't just say the *visible* architecture is 32 bit (which it is), but the "internal" architecture is sort of 16. Afaik, the term computer architecture was coined for the IBM 360, which was a 32-bit architecture, with 8, 16, 32, and 64 bit implementations. The term architecture specifically refers to what the programmer sees, not to the specifics of an implementation. Camiel

10 years

Need help with DSD-440 QBus Controller

by jrw＠lolqb.us

Hi folks, I recently acquired a DSD-440 drive and purchased its accompanying controller on ebay. The controller is configured at defaults according to the manual on Bitsavers. However, unless it is on the bus by itself after the RAM cards, it halts the CPU at location 270. Here are the 4 card configurations I tried, < or > denotes direction of serpentine QBus: Doesn't work: 1 CPU - CPU - CPU - CPU > 2 RAM - RAM - RAM - RAM < 3 RAM - RAM - RAM - RAM > 4 RAM - RAM - RAM - RAM < 5 RAM - RAM - RAM - RAM > 6 DSD - DSD - RAM - RAM < 7 UC07-UC07- --DEQNA-- > 8 --- - --- - --- - --- - --- < 9 --- - --- - --- - --- - --- > OR 1 CPU - CPU - CPU - CPU > 2 RAM - RAM - RAM - RAM < 3 RAM - RAM - RAM - RAM > 4 RAM - RAM - RAM - RAM < 5 RAM - RAM - RAM - RAM > 6 RAM - RAM - --- - --- < 7 DSD - DSD - --- - --- > 8 UC07-UC07- --DEQNA-- < 9 --- - --- - --- - --- - --- > Works (or at least leaves the CPU in the "RUN" state): 1 CPU - CPU - CPU - CPU > 2 RAM - RAM - RAM - RAM < 3 RAM - RAM - RAM - RAM > 4 RAM - RAM - RAM - RAM < 5 RAM - RAM - RAM - RAM > 6 DSD - DSD - RAM - RAM < 7 --- - --- - --- - --- - --- > 8 --- - --- - --- - --- - --- < 9 --- - --- - --- - --- - --- > OR 1 CPU - CPU - CPU - CPU > 2 RAM - RAM - RAM - RAM < 3 RAM - RAM - RAM - RAM > 4 RAM - RAM - RAM - RAM < 5 RAM - RAM - RAM - RAM > 6 RAM - RAM - --- - --- < 7 DSD - DSD - --- - --- > 8 --- - --- - --- - --- - --- < 9 --- - --- - --- - --- - --- > The card says (C)1978 Data Systems Design on it, and the latest manual is (C)1980 - which makes me concerned this is an 18-bit only QBus card. I have not yet tried attaching the drive box to the card, thinking it would at least see the controller without hanging. The box isn't yet clean and ready to go. Any help with this card would be appreciated. Am I doing something wrong, or is this just a bad card? Thanks Julian

10 years

TMB11 drawings?

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Al Kossow > http://www.computerhistory.org/collections/catalog/102753063 Ah, excellent! Any chance those can be scanned at some point? (No rush, I'm not about to start working with one instantly - too much else backed up in the queue! :-) >> I saw some queries about whether a TU10 could be connected to a TMB11. >> The answer is apparently 'yes', for two reasons: >> First, I found docs on a thing called a TMA11 (apparently intermediate >> between the TM11 and TMB11), and one version of the docmentation about >> it talks about the TMA11 and the TU10, but another version talks about >> the TMA11 and the TS03. So, by transitivity, if the TU10 works with a >> TMA11, and a TMA11 works with a TS03, and the TS03 works with a TMB11, >> the TMB11 must work with a TU10... >> Second, I have a report of a TU10 found plugged into a TMB11 in a >> retired computer. > the TMB11 is a special widget for the small Kennedy 7" 800bpi tape drive That's the TS03, right? Anyway, there are indications (above) that it will also work with a TU10. If the TMB11 prints get scanned in, I can take a look them, and see what gives. Further (third) clue: the TMB11 Ops manual says "The TS03 tape transport operates at only one density (800 bpi) and iin only one mode of operation (9 track). The TMB11 is capable of other densities and can operate in the 7-track .. modes." I expect this is to support these modes in the TU10... I originally thought the TB11 was TS03-specific, but after reviewing all the above, I have changed my mind. Having the drawings would be great; I could check them out to confirm that it really can drive a TU10. > we do have the TMA11 drwngs Also excellent! The TM11 ones are online, but not (AFAIK) the TMA11. So if that could get done at some point, too... :-) The two are very similar (a 19" rack backplane full of smaller FLIP CHIPs), so it's not like the RK11-C -> RK11-D, where they re-implemented it to make it cheaper. I'm _guessing_ the latter one can handle 1600 bpi, or some such, but with the prints, the difference could be confirmed. > From: Henk Gooijen > IIRC, I have the printset of the TMB11 and ISTR it is one inch thick! Hmm. No idea why - it's only a quad card and a hex card and 4 smaller standard UNIBUS FLIP CHIPs (M105, M7821, etc). Hard to see that generating 1" of paper (even with the wire list for the custom backplane - a hex-high system unit). Maybe that set includes the TS03 drawings too? Noel

10 years

TMB11 drawings?

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

Does anyone know of the whereabouts of a set of engineering drawings for the TMB11 (also a Technical Manual, although that's more of a luxury)? All I could find on it, online, was the Operator's Manual. Noel PS: In an older thread on TU10's/TM11's here: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/2015-September/011810.html I saw some queries about whether a TU10 could be connected to a TMB11. The answer is apparently 'yes', for two reasons: First, I found docs on a thing called a TMA11 (apparently intermediate between the TM11 and TMB11), and one version of the docmentation about it talks about the TMA11 and the TU10, but another version talks about the TMA11 and the TS03. So, by transitivity, if the TU10 works with a TMA11, and a TMA11 works with a TS03, and the TS03 works with a TMB11, the TMB11 must work with a TU10... Second, I have a report of a TU10 found plugged into a TMB11 in a retired computer.

10 years

68K Macs with MacOS 7.5 still in production use...

by lproven＠gmail.com

http://arstechnica.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=30456459#p30456459 Found via: http://arstechnica.com/apple/2016/09/an-os-9-odyssey-why-do-some-mac-users-… -- Liam Proven ? Profile: http://lproven.livejournal.com/profile Email: lproven at cix.co.uk ? GMail/G+/Twitter/Flickr/Facebook: lproven MSN: lproven at hotmail.com ? Skype/AIM/Yahoo/LinkedIn: liamproven Cell/Mobiles: +44 7939-087884 (UK) ? +420 702 829 053 (?R)

10 years

More Weird Stuff

by cmhanson＠eschatologist.net

There were a couple more MIPS workstations (with MIPS property tags) at Weird Stuff a couple days ago. Two 3xxx-series and an R/12. Also a bunch of DEC stuff including a VT240 base and several keyboards. -- Chris Sent from my iPhone

10 years

Tips for getting to CHM from SJC airport without a car?

by barythrin＠gmail.com

A bit off topic other than tips for anyone else trying to travel cheaply. I have a trip to California in a month although the final destination isn't San Jose. I can fly in to SJC and Google is sounding like I might be able to get a few bus hops from the airport and find my way there? Any tips, tricks or warnings? *(more off-topic below, feel free to stop above for helping anyone venture around to CHM). No idea if I'm testing my luck neighborhood wise and debating taking a bus or train from Mountain view to Pasadena after my free day. Feel free to email me offline if this is too far from list interest. Mostly if anyone was to benefit it would be what's the cheapest route to spend a day at the CHM and then return to the airport again. - John

10 years

Ill-considered complaints [was: RE: early networking (was Re: G4 cube (was Re: 68K Macs with MacOS 7.5 still in production use...))]

by RichA＠LivingComputerMuseum.org

From: Dale H. Cook Sent: Wednesday, September 14, 2016 9:52 AM > Please do not change the subject line in a thread. The subject line of > this thread has been changed twice since it began as "68K Macs with MacOS > 7.5 still in production use..." When you change a subject line the header > information concerning the subject is unchanged, and that is what the > list archives and some email clients go by. There are now three threads > concerning different subjects archived as one thread at classiccmp.org. > If you want to change a subject please start a new thread, and if you > wish you can give the new thread a subject line such as "New Subject (was > Old Subject)" to reflect its origin. Actually, Mr. Cook, the standard for the last 35 years or so has been to change the subject line, with the old subject in SQUARE BRACKETS with the characters "was: " prepended. Any decent newsreader or threading mail reader knows how to deal with that, and threading is unbroken. What was broken in the messages about which you complain is the substitution of parentheses () for brackets []. See the subject line on this message for an example. Rich Rich Alderson Vintage Computing Sr. Systems Engineer Living Computer Museum 2245 1st Avenue S Seattle, WA 98134 mailto:RichA at LivingComputerMuseum.org http://www.LivingComputerMuseum.org/

10 years

Subjects, Topics and Threading

by classiccmp＠crash.com

On 09/14/16 09:52, Dale H. Cook wrote: > > Please do not change the subject line in a thread. The subject line > of this thread has been changed twice since it began as "68K Macs > with MacOS 7.5 still in production use..." When you change a subject > line the header information concerning the subject is unchanged, > and that is what the list archives and some email clients go by. > There are now three threads concerning different subjects archived > as one thread at classiccmp.org. And what's so horrible about that? I miss entire conversations because somebody starts discussing something I *would* find interesting under a misleading Subject: and never changes it. Oh well - people will do what they do, thank goodness for search... How do you justify making everybody conform to your preferred behavior? Even though I did what you wanted in this reply/new topic. ;) But now nobody can see what I didn't quote from your original message without going off and running a search - isn't that annoying too? --S.

10 years

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