10 Aug
2001
10 Aug
'01
7:53 a.m.
Control G is Bell. Some older electronic keyboards,
including the one on
the Apple ][ have the word 'Bell' on the 'G' key.
Actually, ^G is BEL (just three characters). In order:
NUL, SOH, STX, ETX, EOT, ENQ, ACK, BEL, BS, HT, LF, VT, FF, CR, SO, SI,
DLE, DC1, DC2, DC3, DC4, NAK, SYN, ETB, CAN, EM, SUB, ESC, FS, GS, RS,
US, SP, and DEL.
Eight-bit ASCII (at least DEC's implementation) added:
IND, NEL, SSA, ESA, HTS, HTJ, VTS, PLD, PLU, RI, SS2, SS3, DCS, PU1, PU2,
STS, CCH, MW, SPA, EPA, CSI, ST, OSC, PM, and APC.
^Q (Xon), ^R (Yon), ^S (Xoff), ^T (Yoff).
Am I the only person here who instinctively uses ^S to halt screen output
and ^Q to restart it?
I rarely ever use anything other than ^S/^Q, except on a VTxxx terminal,
where I will in the odd instance use the "Hold Screen" key. I'll also
often use ^[ for ESC.
--
Eric Dittman
dittman(a)dittman.net
School Zones: Man's attempt to thwart natural selection.
10 Aug
10 Aug
11:07 a.m.
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: not available
Type: text
Size: 308 bytes
Desc: not available
Url :
http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20010811/5387d931/at…
9:40 a.m.
At 02:53 PM
8/10/01 -0500, Eric wrote
> I'll also often use ^[ for ESC.
A must when using DEC keyboards with
"vi".
Why not use the F10 or F11 key? 
12:03 p.m.
Eric Dittman skrev:
> >At 02:53 PM 8/10/01 -0500, Eric wrote
> >> I'll also often use ^[ for ESC.
>
> >A must when using DEC keyboards with "vi".
>
> Why not use the F10 or F11 key?
Because that takes longer than just hitting ^[?
No, it doesn't.
Besides, our LK201s don't have any ] key to hit. =)
--
En ligne avec Thor 2.6a.
Alle Verallgemeinerungen sind gef?hrlich, sogar diese.
--- Alexandre Dumas der ?ltere
12:11 p.m.
> >At
02:53 PM 8/10/01 -0500, Eric wrote
> >> I'll also often use ^[ for ESC.
>
> >A must when using DEC keyboards with "vi".
>
> Why not use the F10 or F11 key?
Because that takes longer than just hitting ^[?
No, it doesn't.
Besides, our LK201s don't have any ] key to hit. =)
12:05 p.m.
Paul Williams skrev:
Iggy Drougge wrote:
>
> >> I'll also often use ^[ for ESC.
>
> >A must when using DEC keyboards with "vi".
>
> Why not use the F10 or F11 key?
F11 only generates raw ESC in VT100 mode, which has
other drawbacks.
What was DEC's logic behind the exclusion of a proper escape key?
--
En ligne avec Thor 2.6a.
12:10 p.m.
Paul Williams skrev:
The use of ESC [ for ANSI CRT control use was pretty hard for some
people to code for relying on time between characters and all...
So they tried to discourage the use of ESCAPE for anything other than
cursor control.
They did include it on the keyboard -- just made it less than useful for
touch typists. (and vi Unix users...>
Some folks used to use Control-S in their software which also was a
bitch to deal with on DEC terminals and printers. (emacs? WS -- i know>
Bill
--
Bill Gates is a Persian cat and a monocle away from being a
villain in a James Bond movie -- Dennis Miller
bpechter@shell.monmouth.com|pechter@pechter.dyndns.org
Iggy Drougge wrote:
>
> >> I'll also often use ^[ for ESC.
>
> >A must when using DEC keyboards with "vi".
>
> Why not use the F10 or F11 key?
F11 only generates raw ESC in VT100 mode, which
has other drawbacks.
What was DEC's logic behind the exclusion of a proper escape key? 
2:54 p.m.
On Sat, 11 Aug 2001, Bill Pechter wrote:
Some folks used to use Control-S in their software which also was a
bitch to deal with on DEC terminals and printers. (emacs? WS -- i
know>
The first classiccmpy thing I ever did (remember, I'm relatively new :-))
was attach a VT220 to what was then my Linux box so that I could code on
it while my girlfriend (now wife) surfed www. I ran into that particular
problem in emacs when doing that experiment.
What was fun about the whole thing was the set of interesting ways I
could, umm, modify her X session from my VT220. :-)
--
Jeffrey S. Sharp
jss(a)subatomix.com
12 Aug
12 Aug
4:31 a.m.
Iggy Drougge wrote:
Paul Williams skrev:
I'm not sure what you mean by "proper" escape key. If you would like a
key that sends a code that is interpreted by applications as meaning
"cancel" or "exit insert mode", that is fine. However, this key
shouldn't send the control code ESC and expect the application to do
something with this code alone. That usage should have been considered
obsolete by the first issue of ASCII in 1963. ESC alters the meanings of
a certain number of following characters.
I would think that DEC's exclusion of a key that sends ESC alone was a
consequence of placing a number of function keys on the keyboard. If you
put a keys "F1" to "F20" or "Select" or "Help" on
the keyboard, you
quickly run out of 7-bit codes that they could send. Using ESC as an
introducer gives you an extensible system, in the spirit of ANSI X3.64.
(I know X3.64 doesn't define keyboard codes, but the mechanism is
identical).
I think Bill Joy developed vi on an ADM-3a, but I don't know anything
about the control codes for that terminal, so I don't know whether it
might have been considered safe to use a lone ESC in that situation.
As for Emacs' use of ^S to mean something other than XOFF, that is plain
broken.
F11 only generates raw ESC in VT100 mode, which has other drawbacks.
What was DEC's logic behind the exclusion of a proper escape key?
1:01 p.m.
Paul Williams skrev:
Iggy Drougge wrote:
>
> Paul Williams skrev:
> >
> >F11 only generates raw ESC in VT100 mode, which has other drawbacks.
>
> What was DEC's logic behind the exclusion of a proper escape key?
I'm not sure what you mean by "proper"
escape key. If you would like a
key that sends a code that is interpreted by applications as meaning
"cancel" or "exit insert mode", that is fine. However, this key
shouldn't send the control code ESC and expect the application to do
something with this code alone. That usage should have been considered
obsolete by the first issue of ASCII in 1963. ESC alters the meanings of
a certain number of following characters.
I would think that DEC's exclusion of a key that
sends ESC alone was a
consequence of placing a number of function keys on the keyboard. If you
put a keys "F1" to "F20" or "Select" or "Help" on
the keyboard, you
quickly run out of 7-bit codes that they could send. Using ESC as an
introducer gives you an extensible system, in the spirit of ANSI X3.64.
(I know X3.64 doesn't define keyboard codes, but the mechanism is
identical).
IOW, historical reasons. =)
Mind you, DEC terminals are the only remotely modern systems which I've used
lacking a key marked ESC(ape) which does something useful with vi.
--
En ligne avec Thor 2.6a.
Amiga: (noun) The most technologically advanced computer that hardly anyone
cares about.
Use in sentence: "I wanted to buy an Amiga for its low price and great color
graphics, but everyone else seems to be using IBMs or Macintoshes. So, to
remain compatible with the rest of the world, I spent three times as much on a
Macintosh and got only half the graphics capability of an Amiga."
8846
days inactive
8848
days old
12 comments
7 participants
participants (7)
-
ard＠p850ug1.demon.co.uk -
celigne＠tinyworld.co.uk -
cmurillo＠emtelsa.multi.net.co -
dittman＠dittman.net -
jss＠subatomix.com -
optimus＠canit.se -
pechter＠bg-tc-ppp1225.monmouth.com