Charles H Dickman <chd_1 at nktelco.net> wrote:
> Philipp Hachtmann wrote:
>> > Hi Charles,
>> >
>>> >> The OS8 Handbook and the documents you mentioned have about all the
>>> >> information you should need.
>> > But.. I asked here because it's not always easy to actually FIND the
>> > information needed.
>> > By the way I did not yet find out how to rebuild OS/8 from scratch
>> > (including reassembly).
>> >
>> > Philipp
>> >
> I don't think that I understood the source of your troubles. I think
> that the basic problem is that most of the OS/8 system did its own
> thing with the console. There is no getting around that.
True, and which I pointed out already at the start of this thread. :-)
> I suspect that it is impossible to rebuild OS/8 today. I would be
> surprised if OS/8 was actually maintained on a PDP-8. All of the
> diagnostic listing, for example, were generated using PAL10 on a PDP-10.
I very much suspect you're wrong.
I also happen to know that atleast some of the software was definitely
written and maintained on a PDP-8. The reason being that the code was
converted from PAL-8 to MACREL... And that compiler isn't totally
compatible with PAL-8, even through it's a superset. And MACREL don't
even exist on a PDP-10.
Talk with Charles Lasner about it, if you want to hear a really long
comment about the stupidity of DEC, and the problems it caused (sliding
towards OS/78 and OS/278 here).
> I have tried to find a coherent set of binaries and this can be
> difficult too. SET is especially problematical because it requires
> intimate knowledge of the handler it is going to patch. I have the
> opinion that the the suggestions about using SET to change things in the
> KL8-E hander are a red herring, they were probably never added to SET.
SET is definitely a red herring. If nothing else, than just for the fact
that the TTY: driver isn't enough by far for this problem.
DEC's solution was the KL8-JA, which did this in hardware. That made it
work for all occasions, no matter what software, driver or OS you used.
Another solution would be to use the terminal under MULTOS, or something
similar, since then you actually have a device driver in the bottom,
which you can fix this in.
(And then it will work for OS/8 as well, although at a slight
performance penalty sometimes.)
Johnny
--
Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus
|| on a psychedelic trip
email: bqt at softjar.se || Reading murder books
pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol
> -----Original Message-----
> From: cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-
> bounces at classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Robert Jarratt
> Sent: 14 May 2009 00:21
> To: 'General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts'
> Subject: DEC ST506 Interface Adapter Part No 54-17003-01
>
> One of these is on eBay at the moment. I am looking for an ST506
> adapter to
> go into a MicroVAX 3100 Model 80 or a VAXStation 3100 M38. Trouble is I
> can't find any technical information on the part number, just who has
> this
> item in stock. Can anyone tell me if this is the part I need?
>
>
>
> Thanks
>
>
>
> Rob
Looks like it is for a VAXstation 2000. Knowing that, does anyone know if
such a thing could fit (and work) in one of the two machines I mention
above?
Thanks
Rob
Philipp Hachtmann <hachti at hachti.de> wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I just try to get a VT05 working with my PDP-8/e.
> Having a tuned KL8E interface at 2400 baud.
>
> I need fill characters....
> Found a KL8E.PA in the OS/8 V3D sources. It is a two page handler and works.
> But how do I get my system to use it as terminal handler? Or is there another one?
>
> Best wishes,
>
> Philipp :-)
You need to use BUILD to make a new system image, with your device
driver included. However, you also need to understand many programs do
I/O to the console without going through that device driver, but talks
directly with the console.
So it might be that there is no easy solution to your problem.
Johnny
--
Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus
|| on a psychedelic trip
email: bqt at softjar.se || Reading murder books
pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol
Hi Rich,
Any news on the Sigma front?
Lee Courtney
2124 Ashton Avenue
Menlo Park, CA 94025
650-704-3934 cell
--- On Wed, 5/13/09, Rich Alderson <RichA at vulcan.com> wrote:
> From: Rich Alderson <RichA at vulcan.com>
> Subject: RE: DEC VT05 with OS/8 -- basic system rebuild?
> To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" <cctalk at classiccmp.org>
> Date: Wednesday, May 13, 2009, 6:56 PM
> From: Charles H Dickman
> Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 2009 4:07 PM
>
> > I suspect that it is impossible to rebuild OS/8 today.
> I would be
> > surprised if OS/8 was actually maintained on a PDP-8.
> All of the
> > diagnostic listing, for example, were generated using
> PAL10 on a PDP-10.
>
> That is easily remedied.? We can certainly host PAL10
> and any other PDP-10
> based tools (PAL11, for example) on either the Tops-10 2065
> or the TOPS-20
> Toad-1 at PDPplanet.? Let me know what you need, and
> I'll try to track it
> down.
>
>
> Rich Alderson
> Vintage Computing Server Engineer
> Vulcan, Inc.
> 505 5th Avenue S, Suite 900
> Seattle, WA 98104
>
> mailto:RichA at vulcan.com
> (206) 342-2239
> (206) 465-2916 cell
>
> http://www.pdpplanet.org/
>
Does anyone know who sells sheets of uv-blocking labels for eproms?
Google keeps returning stuff about prom dresses.
--
David Griffith
dgriffi at cs.csubak.edu
A: Because it fouls the order in which people normally read text.
Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing?
A: Top-posting.
Q: What is the most annoying thing in e-mail?
One of these is on eBay at the moment. I am looking for an ST506 adapter to
go into a MicroVAX 3100 Model 80 or a VAXStation 3100 M38. Trouble is I
can't find any technical information on the part number, just who has this
item in stock. Can anyone tell me if this is the part I need?
Thanks
Rob
So, you're browsing Ebay and you're interested in PDP things. What do you
do? Select "Computers and Networking" then punch in "pdp". What do you
see? PDP11 boards, PDP8 books, the occasional full computer -- good.
You also see lots of Compaq power supplies with the string "pdp" in their
model name. Also, some plasma displays. pdp == plasma display panel?
Okay, I guess those belong in there too. I should have limited the search
to "Vintage Computers". But check out this item: 160332833428. Checking
further, it appears that this guy lists all 161 of his items under
"Computers and Networking -> Other". What does he sell? Just take a
look.
--
David Griffith
dgriffi at cs.csubak.edu
A: Because it fouls the order in which people normally read text.
Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing?
A: Top-posting.
Q: What is the most annoying thing in e-mail?
Does anyone have a copy of the SMD-E Interface Specification, which is
CDC/Imprimis/Seagate document 64712402? The spec for the earlier SMD
interface is on Bitsavers, but it doesn't look like the SMD-E spec is there.
Thanks!
Eric
I'm interested in talking to anyone who has or had a National
Semiconductor PACE or INS8900 system, or documentation or software for one.
In order to have something halfway interesting to run on the homebrew
IMP-16 system John List designed and built, I decided to start from PACE
software, since the PACE architecture is derived from (but not
binary-compatible with) the IMP-16, which itself was inspired by the
Data General Nova.
A few years ago a friend gave me a copy of the fig-FORTH listing for the
PACE, which turned out to be missing a page. The listing is on
Bitsavers, but a complete listing is now available on the fig-FORTH
implementations page on forth.org:
http://www.forth.org/fig-forth/contents.html
Over the course of the last week, I typed in the fig-FORTH listing (both
source and object code), wrote a PACE cross-assembler, assembled
fig-FORTH and compared the generated object to what I typed in, fixed
the errors, wrote a PACE simulator, and fixed the fatal bug in the "U/"
word of the fig-FORTH listing. (Maybe no one other than the author ever
actually ran PACE fig-FORTH?) Now that it's working I've just started
trying to translate it for the IMP-16, which doesn't have the RADC and
SUBB instructions of the PACE, and which has somewhat different shift,
rotate, and flag instructions.
Google doesn't turn up much about the PACE other than the few manuals
and datasheets already on Bitsavers. I know that a paper tape based
resident assembler existed, as well as a disk operating system with a
resident assembler. There may have also been a BASIC interpreter.
Eric
